Monday, Feb 28, 2022 • 54min
MURDERED: Emma Walker and Mya Peña
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Emma Walker had what looked to the world like a picture-perfect high school relationship — until her football player boyfriend revealed the ugly truth. Mya Pena looked past the red flags and saw a guy in need of unconditional love. And when she couldn’t give that to him, he decided she wouldn’t be giving it to anyone else either.
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Ashley Flowers
Brit Prawat
Transcript
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Break
Ashley Flowers
01:12
I'm your host, Ashley Flowers.
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Brit Prawat
01:14
And I'm brit.
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Ashley Flowers
01:15
And today I want to tell you about two relationships, intense first love relationships that started out okay, but over time turned toxic. Not just for the teenagers in those relationships, but for their families and friends as well.
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01:29
And ultimately for the communities around them. Still reeling from the tragedies. February is
Teen Dating Violence
awareness month in the US
and I wanted to bring you these stories because I know that we have teenage listeners out there and I know we have listeners who are parents of teenagers. Domestic Violence
is not just reserved for adults.Share
01:47
If you're old enough to be in an intimate relationship, then you are old enough to experience violence at the hands of the person who says they love you. But there are red flags, if you know how to spot them and there are ways to protect yourself and those you love. These are the stories of Emma Walker and Mya Peña.
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02:36
The morning of November 21st, 2016. Starts just like any other Monday in the Walker House in
Knoxville
Tennessee.
At around 6:15, Jill Walker is heading into her sixteen year old daughter, Emma's room to wake her for the day, and when Jill walks in, Emma is still under the covers, sound asleep, she tried to stir her, but there was no response.Share
02:56
I mean, she even gives Emma's leg a little like shake, but still nothing. And listen, I know teenagers don't usually bound out of bed at six a. m. But according to reporting by Joseph Diaz and Alexa Valiente for
Abc News
, Emma is usually really easy to wake, but now she isn't moving a muscle and suddenly Jill has this sinking feeling like something is terribly, terribly wrong.Share
03:17
So, on instinct, she reaches over and touches Emma's neck looking for a pulse, but she doesn't feel anything. So, Jill immediately calls 911.
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Brit Prawat
03:26
And is there anything to indicate why Emma would be unresponsive? Like, I don't know, a pre existing health condition or I don't know like a bottle of pills by the bed, anything like that?
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Ashley Flowers
03:35
No, no, nothing like that that I'm aware of.
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03:37
I've heard bits and pieces of the 911 call, but not the whole thing. So, I'm not sure if Jill had any suspicions right off the bat, but someone along the chain must have because there's an episode of 2020 on this case called Shot In The Dark and in it, one of the responding officers says that when the call comes into police it was tagged as a possible suicide.
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03:56
And when first responders arrived, the only thing that they can see that was really out of the ordinary is just this tiny bit of blood on Emma's pillow.
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04:03
So, they assume that she likely ingested something that caused her to maybe vomit and ultimately overdose, but honestly how she died isn't super clear, at least not at first. But then they see something, a tiny
Bullet Hole
right on the wall next to Emma's bed next to her pillow and when they looked closer at Emma's body, everyone is shocked to discover a single bullet wound behind her left ear.Share
04:28
They think the shot came from somewhere outside and one lap around the walkers backyard proves them right there on the lawn about five ft from the exterior of the house. They find a single spent shell casing and as they continue walking around the outside of the house, they find another spent shell casing and a live round and wouldn't you know it? There's a second
Bullet Hole
into Emma's room.Share
Brit Prawat
04:49
Why didn't investigators notice the second one when they were in the room?
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Ashley Flowers
04:53
Well, the second shot had actually been fired from a different location in like a totally different wall on that episode of 2020 that I mentioned, they created a reconstruction of the trajectory of those bullets and where they ended up, which actually found really helpful. I'm gonna send it to you and you can see it in our app as well.
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Brit Prawat
05:10
Wow, okay, so like actually said, if you're listening in the fan club app, you'll see this photo on your screen. But basically it shows Emma's up against two walls, kind of like a corner, like the headboard against one exterior wall and the side against another and one bullet came through each wall, but they were fired basically into the same place, which is essentially her pillow?
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Ashley Flowers
05:29
Right? And actually, that's where police find the second bullet inside Emma's pillow.
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Brit Prawat
05:33
So, this isn't some kind of drive by shooting? She was targeted.
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Ashley Flowers
05:36
Yes. And they must have known her well enough because I mean, it seems like they know exactly where her head would be when she slept.
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Brit Prawat
05:43
Well and she's a 60 year old living in the suburbs. Like the list of people who would want her dead. Can't be that long.
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Ashley Flowers
05:48
No. And in fact, the image of Emma that's emerged just based on the very early hours of this investigation is not one of a girl with like this list of sworn enemies, like you're saying. Quite the opposite actually, as far as police could tell, Emma was a bubbly bright, friendly high school student, a cheerleader, she's on the honor roll.
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06:06
She even had a part time job at a local supermarket and volunteered at an animal shelter and she was working toward a very clear goal for her future. She wanted to be a NICU Nurse.
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Brit Prawat
06:16
And she has no secret second life or anything?
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Ashley Flowers
06:19
No, no secret second life, but in all the conversations police are having with Emma's parents and her friends, there is one name that keeps coming up over and over and that's Riley Gaul.
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Brit Prawat
06:31
And Riley is?
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Ashley Flowers
06:33
Emma's ex boyfriend, her eighteen year old college football playing very recent ex boyfriend.
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06:39
Emma had actually just broken up with Riley after like two years of dating and everyone who knows Emma says the same thing that Riley had been taking that break up really hard, not because it was their first break up, these two were on again, off again, always fighting and making up, always breaking up and getting back together.
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06:56
But this time something about this time felt final like Emma was done according to more reporting from
Abc News
, Riley became more and more controlling over Emma as time went on to a point where he was dictating what she wore, who she hung out with, what she did, he seemed to hate the idea of her spending time with anyone other than him.Share
07:17
One of her friends actually told Dateline that if Emma did go somewhere with her friends without Riley it would be nothing for him to call her like twenty, thirty times and send a hundred texts.
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Brit Prawat
07:28
Whoa, whoa that is a major red flag. Did Emma recognized that this wasn't normal?
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Ashley Flowers
07:34
Well, by the time I got to that point yes, but her friends had been seeing the red flags for a lot longer and they had been telling Emma that Riley's behavior wasn't okay. But every time she would brush off the concerns and here's the thing, they weren't just worried because of what they saw through Emma. They'd actually also seen a lot of Riley's crap firsthand like they'd occasionally see Emma's social media and phone activity.
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07:56
So, they would see these really nasty messages coming in from Riley after he and Emma would fight. Saying how much he hated her and how she is the worst person he's ever met or how she's dead to him, that kind of thing. And it was awful the way that he talked to Emma in those moments but he was always quick to apologize and she was always just as quick to take him back.
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08:17
Emma's parents Jill and Mark tried to talk to her about their concerns several times, but nothing seemed to work and the longer this went on, the more and more withdrawn and combative Emma had become.
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Brit Prawat
08:28
And you know, there's such a delicate balance with teenagers too. Like you don't want to push too hard and risk having them withdraw even further. And in this case risk pushing her even closer to this guy. But you also can't sit back and do nothing like that sends a message too, it's really tough to figure out the right balance between kind of push and pull in situations like this.
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Ashley Flowers
08:47
And based on everything that I've read and watched on this case, it seems like Emma's parents, they were trying so hard to find that sweet spot trying to help her see Riley's behavior for what it really was and sort of guiding her toward making her own decisions when it came to her relationship.
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09:01
But when that didn't work, they took away her phone and they forbid her to see him. But I mean that didn't work either. It was like whatever action Jill and Mark took Riley and Emma found some way around it, but around the end of october that year they dropped the hammer in a big way, they actually grounded Emma, she was allowed to go to school, go to cheerleading and that's it and they were monitoring every move that she made, making sure she went straight from school to practice and then home again.
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Brit Prawat
09:28
Okay. But I assumed that Emma and Riley can still see each other at school, right?
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Ashley Flowers
09:32
So no, not anymore. Actually remember Riley had graduated, so he had gone off to university that fall and while he was only a half hour away, he at least wasn't in the same building all day every day and I don't know if the timing was just really good or what, but Jill and Mark's approach seemed to actually work and by mid November, Emma and Riley had broken up and Emma told her friends that this time it was for good and of course her friends and family were ecstatic, but like I said Riley, he did not take the breakup well.
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10:01
About two weeks before Emma's death, he had been taken to the hospital by his friends after overdosing on pills. According to W. V. L. T, Riley was back on campus couple of days later and seeing a counselor, but otherwise he was physically fine.
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10:15
But Emma's friends tell police that this kind of stuff. Riley would do all the time to try and manipulate Emma into taking him back and on the Friday before the murder. Riley had really leveled up. On that night, November 18th, Emma's parents let her go out with a group of friends to a sleepover party.
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10:33
Now this is her first time out in weeks and around 11:30 she started getting these really weird text from a strange number saying that Riley had been kidnapped and if she didn't come outside alone, the kidnappers were going to hurt him. So, she grabbed her friends and went outside but I didn't see anything so she figured it was Riley and one of his friends from college pulling some kind of prank on her though, not a super funny prank, but the text keep coming and they get even more aggressive.
Share
11:01
I'm actually gonna have you read one I pulled from Jamie Satterfield reporting in the
Knoxville
News Sentinel
.Share
Brit Prawat
11:06
It says quote, "We have him now if you don't care about him anymore than it shouldn't bother, you call the police and he dies your choice. If you'd like to hear his final screams, give me a call, he's in a ditch beside her house. It's a shame you can all of a sudden not value someone's life." End quote.
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11:23
So, what is this kidnapper looking for from Emma like money?
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Ashley Flowers
11:27
No, and honestly there isn't really a clear ask as far as I can tell, it's mostly just demanding that she come outside the house alone and eventually again she did go outside again, not alone, but with her friends and this time they actually spot something or someone laying face down in the ditch and it was Riley, he got up acting all confused and holding his head like he'd been hit saying like, "Where am I? How did I get here? What happened?"
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11:53
But Emma wasn't buying it and in fact she was absolutely furious about the whole thing when she didn't take Riley's bait and rushed to his side to help him, he left and she went back to the party with her friends and naturally she was upset because they were broken up, like she just wanted him to leave her alone and he kind of did for the rest of the night, there were no more calls, no more text and eventually she was able to kind of shake it off and enjoy the rest of her night.
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12:18
The next morning Emma packed up her stuff and headed back home, she was getting ready to head out to meet her mom. When all of a sudden out of nowhere, this man dressed head to toe in black, black sunglasses, black, everything started pounding on Emma's door trying to get into her house.
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Speaker 4
12:34
Now she was home alone as you can imagine freaking out. So she actually ended up texting Riley asking for help and he of course responded right away, he came to the house, checked everything inside, looked around outside, but there was no sign of this man in black, but Emma was clearly shaken by the whole thing.
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Brit Prawat
12:49
And did he call police?
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Ashley Flowers
12:51
Well, according to the episode of
Dateline
No, but Emma told the whole story to her mom and her mom had a sense right away that the man in black wasn't a stalker or a burglar. Like Emma thought she figured it was probably Riley pulling another one of his stunts trying to get Emma's attention.Share
Speaker 4
13:08
But Emma was like, no way not possible. Like he wouldn't go that far. He wouldn't do that.
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Ashley Flowers
13:12
So, to come back to the present investigation police here both of these stories and think that there's for sure a connection either there's a stranger out there stalking Emma and that's who killed her or it's all part of the same pattern of behavior from Riley, a pattern that may have escalated all the way to murder.
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13:28
But later that same day, investigators are already ruling out the stranger theory because they're handed a police report that puts a gun matching the kind that killed Emma right in the hands of their main suspect.
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Break
Ashley Flowers
14:50
It turns out Riley's grandfather filed a report that weekend saying that his gun had been stolen and he suspected Riley had taken it and was worried that Riley might hurt himself, but when his grandfather confronted him he flat out denied knowing anything about it.
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15:05
And if that's not concerning enough police get a call from Riley's two friends, one of them, this kid named Alex says that he knows Riley stole that gun from his grandfather because Riley had shown it to him.
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15:15
Riley apparently told Alex that he needed the gun for protection because he was worried that people were out to get him and Emma, the other friend that called into police was a kid named Noah and he tells them that Riley had called him just that weekend asking him how to get rid of fingerprints on a gun?
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Brit Prawat
15:32
I'm sorry what?
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Ashley Flowers
15:33
Noah like, first of all why do you want to know that? And second why in the heck are you asking me?
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15:39
That, honestly was like my question like, I don't know if I have a person in my contact list from like this person knows how to get rid of finger friends.
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15:46
I mean it's just wipe it down right? Like I mean, I think it's just weird that he called anyone.
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Brit Prawat
15:50
Like having a friend that's like that person, okay.
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Ashley Flowers
15:53
And ultimately Riley's like chill, chill is not me asking my roommates asking, I'm asking for a friend is basically what he's saying, which is still freaking weird.
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16:02
And Noah, kind of knew that this was b. s because unbeknownst to Riley, Alex had already like talked to Noah and told him his whole story about how Riley had taken his grandfather's gun so clearly like he knows it's not your friend is not asking this like bro, it's you.
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Brit Prawat
16:16
Right, So, was this fingerprints question before or after Emma's murder?
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Ashley Flowers
16:21
It was before, but truly at the time they said that the idea that Riley might hurt Emma didn't even cross their minds, they were more worried about Riley using the gun to harm himself. But now that Emma has been murdered there, seeing it all through different eyes.
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Brit Prawat
16:35
So, do they know for sure that this is the gun that killed Emma?
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Ashley Flowers
16:39
Well, they know it's the same type, like it's a
Nine Millimeter
, but to know if it's the actual one, they need to find it so they can test it. To do that, they started by asking the person that they think might know where it is, Riley. According to the Abc story. When detectives go and talk to him, honestly, they still have an open mind.Share
16:55
Maybe he's just a grieving ex boyfriend, but when they actually sit down with him, that's not what they get at all.
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17:01
Instead they see something they've seen many times before, a dark side, not to mention he's just actually weird, like instead of saying Emma's name, he keeps referring to her as the girl or the girl who passed away.
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Brit Prawat
17:16
Almost like he's trying to distance himself from the girl he dated for two years. That's definitely weird.
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Ashley Flowers
17:22
That's that was kind of my thought too. Except he can't really distance himself from her because everyone already knows like you said they've been dating for two years and they all know that they had to just broken up and he was a wreck about it ultimately Riley denies stealing his grandfather's gun and detectives give him a few opportunities to turn that one around before they tell him about that call that they got from Alex and Noah.
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17:44
And when they do Riley's like I have no idea why Alex would say any of this because it just didn't happen and he said he had called Noah asking about fingerprints but it really was his roommate asking.
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Brit Prawat
17:54
Oh he's sticking to that story. Okay.
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Ashley Flowers
17:56
But he's like, I have no idea why my roommates asking. I just was doing him a favor by trying to help him find out. According to Matt Laken who reported for the
Knoxville
News Sentinel
. Riley just says quote, "He's a weird guy." End quote.Share
18:07
So, police move on to Riley's whereabouts on the night of the murder and he tells them that he had spent pretty much the entire weekend trying to reach Emma, but she ignored all of his calls and all of his texts.
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18:18
Now he did end up connecting with her eventually on Sunday night, that's the last night she was alive using a friend's phone since she wasn't answering any calls from him, he wanted to call her with a different number. But even then she told him basically just to stop calling it is over and then she blocked that number two.
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Brit Prawat
18:34
So, she's like serious about not talking to him again. This isn't just to appease her parents. She's really truly done with this relationship and just wants him gone out of her life.
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Ashley Flowers
18:44
Totally. Now in addition to a lot of this, like I loved Emma, I would never do this kind of stuff. Riley tells police that he actually couldn't have killed her. He says that he wasn't even in
Knoxville
when she died.Share
18:56
He says that he was in
Maryville
on his college campus for almost all of Sunday night and Monday morning except for like this brief trip to his grandparents place in Knoxville
where he was there just long enough to log on to his school account from his grandparents laptop and then he drove straight back to Maryville
and he says that when he got back he was parked in front of the athletics building on campus for hours, just like looking at pictures of him and Emma on his phone in his car, like crying and trying to process their break up.Share
Brit Prawat
19:26
Like just sitting there in his car.
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Ashley Flowers
19:29
That's what he says and he tells police it's something he's done before and while it seems kind of ridiculous, especially in the middle of the night. I don't think it's that while to think that his car might actually be the only place that he can go for privacy. I mean when you think about it, he's like in a college, he lives in a dorm with roommates.
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Brit Prawat
19:48
But how long was he in the car?
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Speaker 4
19:50
Well, pieces of the interrogation tapes were played on the show Crime And Justice with
Ashleigh Banfield
and Riley's exact words to police are quote, "I sat in the parking lot in front of the athletic center. Just sat there for about 2 to 3 hours and just looking at pictures of us and stuff like that. I sent her a text at 12 55. I just told her how much I loved her and that I was sorry, she didn't want what we had anymore. And she was going to do great things in the future and that is why I was going to leave her alone after that. I fell asleep around then and then so I woke up to the call about what happened." End quote.Share
Brit Prawat
20:24
So, he's saying he was in his car alone first crying and looking at pictures, then he texted her then he was sleeping until whenever the news makes its way to him that Emma was dead?
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Ashley Flowers
20:36
So, that's what it sounds like to me. But either the story ends up changing or maybe just gets fleshed out a little bit during the course of the interview because what he ends up landing on is that he did go back to his dorm around 4:30 and fell asleep till morning.
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Brit Prawat
20:52
So, basically he has no alibi is what you're saying. Do police ask him about the weird Friday night kidnapping thing? Or the person dressed in all black being on Emma's door at all?
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Ashley Flowers
21:02
They do. And he denies having anything to do with either of those things. He actually tells them the whole story of the kidnapping about these two guys who basically plucked him up off the street and shoved him in a vehicle and stole his phone and he says that he wasn't the person banging on Emma's door dressed in all black.
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21:18
He was the person who came to help find that person banging on Emma's door dressed in all black but police aren't really buying any of this and once they pull cell records and tower data on Riley's phone, they know for sure that his whole, I sat in the car on campus and cried for three hours is a load of B. S because his phone shows that he was actually in
Knoxville
from 12:30 a. m. to 3:45 a. m. on the night Emma was murdered.Share
21:45
But that's not enough to arrest Riley or even enough to hold him any longer. What police really need to clinch this case is a murder weapon. They are sure that it's Riley's grandfather's gun, they just need to figure out where he's hiding it.
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21:59
They cut Riley loose and they keep watching him. But the real game changer of a lead in this case comes the next day in the form of a phone call on Tuesday, this is the day after Emma was found dead. Police here again from Riley's friends Alex and Noah, they tell police that Riley told them that he did in fact still have his grandfather's gun and that he needed to get rid of it ASAP.
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Brit Prawat
22:21
Okay, wait so after he knows that his friends went to the police with information. Riley is still like yeah I can trust you. Let me see if you can help me get rid of this gun.
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Ashley Flowers
22:31
Again. Thank God criminals are dumb and here's the thing though when he's talking them, he still swears, it's not a murder weapon. He says he's just concerned about having it and police finding it thinking that he says you know it's something that's gonna like send him to jail for a crime he didn't commit, but Alex and Noah don't believe him.
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22:47
They have been watching him basically come apart at the seams and as much as they care about their friend, they do not want him to get away with murder and they think that they can help investigators either get a confession or at least smoke him out.
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Break
Ashley Flowers
24:07
So, Alex and Noah meet up with detectives that evening who wired them up with mics and a hidden camera so police can listen in the whole time and they send them out to meet with Riley. Alex and Noah, invite him over to hang out and they talk for a while. They talked about Emma's murderer and how Riley definitely didn't do it, would never do it.
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24:26
But having this gun around was going to be a problem for him Anyway, then Riley asks them if they'll go with him to get rid of the gun and I don't mean it like some point in the future. I mean like right now will you leave with me?
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24:38
He says he wants to go to the bluffs, it's like wooded area next to the
Tennessee
river and throw the gun into the water.Share
Brit Prawat
24:43
So does he have this gun on him? Like right now?
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Ashley Flowers
24:47
So, not in that moment they have to go get it. So, they all pile into the car and go to Riley's stepfather's place, Riley goes inside and emerges a few minutes later with a garbage bag and off they go towards the bluffs now Alex and Noah, don't actually know for sure if the gun is actually in the bag and this whole sting operation is based on them actually seeing the gun and police moving in to make an arrest.
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25:11
So, the two boys like are trying to coax him into showing them the gun the whole time they're driving. And finally after they've parked at the bluffs, he finally shows it to them again. Police are listening in. But Noah and Alex also have this group text going on with detectives and so Noah sends a note like the eagle has landed or whatever and within a minute and a half that must have felt like a lifetime.
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25:34
The car is descended upon by lights and sirens and police who take Riley away in handcuffs.
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Brit Prawat
25:41
I'm not gonna lie. That is a really risky freaking move for these kids to be just hanging out with their unhinged buddy who they know has a gun and suspect just killed someone they know with it.
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Ashley Flowers
25:52
Listen to this. So I guess Alex and Noah, when they were interviewed for
Dateline
they said that they didn't even tell their parents that this was going down. Like you know, they were like hiding it, they say that they didn't have time. It just all came together so fast.Share
26:04
But their role in Reilly's arrest was crucial and what police found in that trash bag helps put the entire puzzle together because it's not just the gun, there's actually other stuff in there too, gloves, garbage bags, black clothes, sneakers, blacked out with duct tape. Everything
Riley
would need to sneak into Emma's backyard that night undetected and everything, that mysterious man in black had been wearing the day before.Share
26:29
It takes two years for Riley's case to finally go to trial. But once it does he's facing seven charges according to W. V. L. T. For first degree murder, felony murder. Especially aggravated stalking theft, tampering with evidence, reckless endangerment and using a firearm while committing a felony.
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26:49
He pleaded not guilty to those charges and prosecutors are prepared to move forward with the case that they believe proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that it was Riley who killed Emma, not some mysterious stranger.
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26:60
But then on the first day of the trial the defense team shocks everyone by turning the tables and admitting that Riley did fire the gun into Emma's room that night but they say it wasn't first degree murder, it was reckless homicide.
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Brit Prawat
27:14
Okay, but isn't that more like doing something risky that may have resulted in death but not like a for sure result? I feel like reckless homicide is more of like if a drunk driver gets into an accident and in that accident a death occurs or something like that.
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Speaker 4
27:30
Yeah that's actually my understanding of it too.
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Brit Prawat
27:32
But Riley fired a gun into her pillow from two angles at her head. Like how is that reckless homicide?
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Ashley Flowers
27:40
Well, because according to the defense it's reckless homicide because Riley they're saying didn't intend for the bullets to kill Emma.
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Brit Prawat
27:47
I mean what did he think the bullets would do? Bounce?
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Ashley Flowers
27:50
Well, he said that he just wanted to scare her and specifically to scare her into calling him for help so that he could like swoop in and be the hero once again.
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Brit Prawat
27:58
I mean, which is what he did with the whole man in black situation. But if you want to scare her, don't shoot at her head. I don't know.
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Ashley Flowers
28:05
Well, according to Jamie Satterfield reporting for the
News Sentinel
Riley says that he didn't know the bullets would even go through the wall, let alone into Emma's head. His lawyer says that it was just a dumb mistake, a huge mistake. One that cost Riley the love of his life.Share
Brit Prawat
28:19
Okay. I, I actually buy the whole like hero complex thing like seems to track with his behavior anyway. I just feel like you can't stand five feet from a wall, fire a gun and not expected to go through the walls. I mean you would at least have to think maybe that would happen. Right?
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Ashley Flowers
28:35
Well, and that's what the prosecution was saying and considering that they have Riley's own friends testifying against him, their argument is a really strong one.
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28:43
The jury only deliberated for four hours before calling B. S on the reckless homicide thing and they find Riley guilty of first degree murder, which in
Tennessee
, you might remember from the Santoyo Brown story we covered last month carries a mandatory life sentence with at least fifty-one years before he can be considered for parole, a life for a life as Riley's friend Alex says, and I wish I could tell you that this was just some terrible one off story, but it's not. Teen Dating Violence
is happening all too often.Share
29:14
We just don't talk about it very much and when we do come across stories like these, they aren't always told through a
Teen Dating Violence
or Domestic Violence
lens, but they should be because that's what they are.Share
29:24
Again, I wish I could tell a story is the exception and not the rule when it comes to
Teen Dating Violence
, but it's not and I want to tell you another story today. One that is similar in so many ways but different in others.Share
29:36
This story starts just after three on a Tuesday afternoon in mid January of 2020.
Share
29:41
That's when Audra Peña is at work waiting for the usual text from her seventeen year old daughter, Mya telling her she's home from school every day. Mya sends the same text message when she arrives at their home in
Highlands Ranch
Colorado
. "I'm home mama" with a yellow heart emoji.Share
29:55
That's the message. Audra is waiting for and usually comes in before 3 "15 but 3:15 comes and goes and there's no message. Now there's always a chance that Mya got delayed or maybe just distracted. So, she picks up the phone and calls Mya, but Mya doesn't answer.
Share
30:10
According to Deborah Takahara's reporting for Fox 31. Audra knows immediately that something's not right because Mya and her big sister, Alexis know that when mom calls you answer, not because Audra is strict or even heavy handed, but because they know how much Audra worries about them. She's a single mom, which means she doesn't just carry the physical load of two parents.
Share
30:30
When it comes to the day to day work of raising kids, she carries the worry for two parents too. So, Audra calls again and again and again and by 3:30 she can't ignore the horrible feeling in her gut anymore so she grabs her stuff and leaves the office to go check and see if Mya's home as she drives. She still keeps hitting redial, just to hear that never ending ringing on the other end and then at some point it just stops.
Share
30:56
Mya's phone starts rolling right over to voicemail. Like it had been shut off and that sends Audra's worry off the charts. She already knew that Mya's day had been going downhill since around lunchtime and she felt like this is all wrong.
Share
Brit Prawat
31:10
Well, what happened at lunch?
Share
Ashley Flowers
31:12
Well, Audra knew that the reason Mya's day had taken a nose dive almost certainly had something to do with her on again off again eighteen year old boyfriend, Samuel Hoffman and actually when Audras phone rings at 3:45 she's still driving home at this point, it's Sam calling her to ask if Mya had come home. And the question throws her off guard because she would have bet money that if Mya had gone anywhere other than home, like she was supposed to, it's because she went somewhere with Sam.
Share
31:37
But Audra can clearly hear the panic and Sam's voice too and she tells him, listen, I'm on my way to the house now to check on Mya like please come meet me there, it's four o'clock by the time Audra gets there and the car is barely even stopped and she's already sprinting towards the house, she walks through the door calling for Mya the whole time checking room to room upstairs and downstairs, but Mya isn't there.
Share
31:59
So, Audra calls her daughter's friends and they tell her that Mya hadn't hung around after the final bell after school, she had left immediately after classes were dismissed.
Share
32:07
Based on the account of the day that Audra gives on the Mya's World
Facebook
page. Her friends didn't know where she was headed off to, but they do say that Mya had been basically glued to her phone right up until the point that she was walking out of the school doors and she had been visibly upset by something and Audra knows that it could only be one thing, Sam, you see, just a week prior, Audra had put her foot down and told Mya that she couldn't see Sam anymore, because the relationship wasn't a good one.Share
32:35
It had basically up to that point just been like months of heartache and tears and as a mother, she knew that's not how a good relationship should make you feel.
Share
Brit Prawat
32:42
And was Mya okay with that or did you kind of see it as a more like ill fated, star crossed lovers kind of situation?
Share
Ashley Flowers
32:49
Mya seemed to understand and honestly even accept it. But she was still really sad and Audra knew that she was also kind of a chip off the old block. So she wouldn't put it past her daughter to make plans to defy her mother and see Sam anyway. And so she keeps going back to that conversation she had had with Sam and sure he was saying that he didn't know where Mya was and he was asking her if she knew where Mya was.
Share
33:11
But she can't shake the feeling that's now kind of settled into her bones that he was lying. That maybe he called to check in on Mya knowing exactly where she was because she was with him.
Share
Brit Prawat
33:22
Almost like a cover or something.
Share
Ashley Flowers
33:24
So, she gets back into the car and drives through their neighborhood looking up and down the streets for any sign of Mya or Sam. All the way to Mya's school. The whole time, she's calling both of them over and over again. Getting no answer from either.
Share
Brit Prawat
33:39
So, I assumed Sam didn't actually meet Audra at the house then?
Share
Ashley Flowers
33:43
No, which again, I don't know how long I just stayed there and I don't know how she was feeling, but for me would make me even more suspicious. But finally at 4:45 Audra's phone rings and it is Sam by this time she's frantic and she asked if he's been able to reach Mya and he says, no, she won't answer my calls. She's done with me that she never wants to see me or even speak to me again.
Share
34:04
And that's when Audra's heart starts to race. Because when she had talked to Sam, you know what? An hour ago he had sounded panicked but now he just sounds cold and for her it's really unsettling.
Share
34:16
So, she asked him again, like come meet me, come help me look for Mya. And he says sorry, I can't help, I'm busy. But I hope you find her. And then just hangs up.
Share
Brit Prawat
34:25
Even though what, like an hour, hour and a half before he was asking her where Mya was?
Share
Ashley Flowers
34:31
Now this is where the details of this story get a little messy because I don't know who reported Mya missing or when. Just that by this time, police are actually already looking for her. And for Sam. If not because of a missing persons report because of something that they'd seen on Sam's social media.
Share
Break
Ashley Flowers
37:18
Several people had seen something Sam posted on social media talking about how he was concerned about his own behavior with Mya.
Share
Brit Prawat
37:27
And when did he post this? What did he say?
Share
Ashley Flowers
37:30
Well, the details have never been made public as far as I can tell. So, I don't know exactly what it said though in that K. O Double A story, they mentioned a rumor going around that it involved a photo, maybe a photo of something happening to Mya.
Share
37:45
But police have never confirmed that. And again it is a rumor. So I don't know.
Share
37:49
But what I do know is that the people who saw whatever this post was called police as soon as they saw it and that whatever it was, was concerning enough for police to send out Ebola with the description as soon as they found out and that bola went out before 3:30. So, I'm not even sure that Audra knows that they're even looking because at that point she was just driving home still calling Mya.
Share
Brit Prawat
38:12
Right.
Share
Ashley Flowers
38:12
But by the time she speaks to Sam that second time at 4:45 police have already been looking for both Mya and Sam for over an hour. And when I say police, I don't even mean just like local police at the
Douglas County Sheriff's
office but a total of seven law enforcement agencies, everything from neighboring sheriff's to the Colorado
state patrol.Share
Brit Prawat
38:31
Oh, so, clearly whatever Sam posted was pretty serious.
Share
Ashley Flowers
38:35
Totally. And even though Sam was only eighteen, he's actually already known to police at least a little bit. Janet Corvettes reported for
Nine News
Denver that he had, had prior contact with law enforcement because of something that had happened on school property.Share
38:50
What? I don't know. But it ultimately led to an emergency
Mental Health
hold and he'd also been arrested the year before and charged with third degree assault in a Domestic Violence
incident.Share
Brit Prawat
39:00
Was that with Mya or someone else?
Share
Ashley Flowers
39:03
No, not Mya. It was someone else. This had happened in March of 2019, which I'm not sure if that's before Mya and Sam met, but it was for sure before they started dating. Now, I don't have a step by step narrative of the police's search for Mya and Sam but I was able to piece together a few things.
Share
39:18
Audra shared some photos on the Mayas world
Facebook
page of what looked to me like police reports just based on the content and the fact that the names and identifying information was redacted and the content in those reports suggest that police visit the home of one of Sam's friends who says that they might actually be able to help.Share
39:35
They say that Sam had called that evening and said that he'd blown a tire somewhere in
Colorado Springs
and had gotten off the highway so he could fix it.Share
39:44
Sam apparently didn't know which exit or anything just that there was a bunch of trees around. So I'm pretty sure police used that information along with data from Sam's cell phone pings to hone in on an area off of I 25.
Share
39:56
So, police blast that information out to this huge multi agency law enforcement team that they've assembled saying, hey, we think that they might have a flat tire and they're likely trying to hide the car and here is the general area that they're in.
Share
Brit Prawat
40:08
So, police are looking for both of them. Do they think that they're together like they're running away together?
Share
Ashley Flowers
40:15
I don't know if they actually are treating this as like Mya being with Sam voluntarily or more of a kidnapping situation.
Share
40:21
I mean it almost doesn't even matter anyway since police are clearly treating Mya as endangered and missing. So, it feels more like they think they're together and it's not voluntary. Anyway, it's the
Colorado
state troopers who first spot what looks like Sam's vehicle kind of lurking off the side of the road in this area around I 25.Share
40:39
And at first they think, okay, finally we've got them, but once they get close enough they realize it's actually not Sam and Mya.
Share
Brit Prawat
40:47
So, there just happens to be some other car lurking off a side road in the exact area that these two kids are thought to be hiding?
Share
Ashley Flowers
40:54
Well, not exactly, doesn't just happen to be another vehicle in that same area. It's a news van and it's there on purpose. I assume that they had heard about the location over police radio because when Colorado Springs Crime Watch wrote about it, they said that the news truck beat police to the area.
Share
Brit Prawat
41:13
Oh, I bet those cops were just thrilled.
Share
Ashley Flowers
41:16
They're not site and they obviously send the reporters away. So, I know there's at least one false alarm before two officers finally spot the right vehicle pulled over on the side of the road on I 25 under past at 7:39 PM.
Share
41:29
And Sam is actually standing outside of the car at this point but he spots police before they pull up and by the time they stopped the car he's back inside his, the officers climb out of their car and start walking towards Sam's vehicle. But before they can even get close enough to speak to him. they hear the unmistakable sound of a
Gunshot
.Share
41:51
It shatters the back window into a million pieces and then there's just nothing, silence. They walked towards Sam's vehicle not knowing what to expect and when they're close enough to look in the windows, they realized that their too late.
Share
42:04
Mya is laying dead in the backseat and Sam who had been standing on the road right in front of them. Not even thirty seconds before is in the front, dead from a single
Gunshot
wound to the head.Share
Brit Prawat
42:15
So wait, no other shots fired? I mean that means that Mya was already dead before the police got there.
Share
Ashley Flowers
42:22
Yes, she had to have been police shut down that section of the road so they can do a thorough search of that scene and they send both bodies to the coroner's office for autopsy. Now Mya's official cause of death and time of death will be important to know. Of course. But otherwise there is very little mystery here for investigators.
Share
42:39
It's clear that what they're investigating is a murder suicide. The question isn't what happened or who was responsible. It's how did this happen?
Share
42:47
And just as importantly, how could it have been prevented from happening in the first place? By the following afternoon, investigators have pieced together a loose timeline of events for the day before. They confirmed that the reason Mya left the school in a hurry was in fact to meet Sam just as her mother suspected.
Share
43:05
Police think he picked her up around 3 "15 and then drove less than a mile down the street to an off campus parking lot, which is when and where he killed Mya.
Share
Brit Prawat
43:13
Wait, they think he killed her like right after school?
Share
Ashley Flowers
43:16
They think that that happened in like the narrow window between 3:15 and 3:30.
Share
Brit Prawat
43:21
And in a parking lot is just like an underground parking lot or something?
Share
Ashley Flowers
43:25
No, wide open, broad daylight. Now police only really ever say that the parking lot that they went to was off school property, but based on a
Facebook
post that I found from the connections church, I'm pretty sure that that's the lot they're talking about which the church itself describes as quote, "Very active between two and four p. m with more than 100 students being picked up and dropped off." End quote.Share
Brit Prawat
43:48
And no one saw anything or like even heard a
Gunshot
?Share
Ashley Flowers
43:52
No, no one saw or heard anything as far as I know, but for sure they wouldn't have heard a
Gunshot
because Sam didn't shoot Mya when her autopsy results come back, it shows that he strangled her and Stabbed
her twice, once in the leg and again in the chest.Share
Brit Prawat
44:07
Oh, okay, so maybe there wouldn't have been like a loud
Gunshot
, but I have to think they would still attract attention, especially between what, 3:15 and 3:30 near a school with people coming and going by the hundreds.Share
Ashley Flowers
44:20
You'd think so. But again, as far as I know, police found zero witnesses and that might be because even though Sam wasn't like a big dude, like in some pictures, he looks even smaller than Mya, he knew what he was doing.
Share
44:31
Like I'm pretty sure he knew how to make someone unconscious pretty quickly and effectively because he had training in mixed martial arts.
Share
Brit Prawat
44:37
And the police are sure about the timing of 3:15 to 3:30?
Share
Ashley Flowers
44:42
As far as I know.
Share
Brit Prawat
44:43
Okay. I asked because first of all it does seem so bonkers that there would be absolutely no witnesses even to a quiet or silent crime. But the other thing I keep coming back to our, those calls that Sam made to Audra of 3:15 to 3:30 time of death means Mya was already dead when Sam called Audra the first time being like, hey, did Mya make it home or whatever? Like what?
Share
Ashley Flowers
45:07
Well, that's exactly what police think happened, which is chilling. And actually, we know that Audra wasn't the only person Sam called. The police reports note a few calls to friends. We know there were two calls that he made to Audra.
Share
45:19
Then the social media post police mentioned to. So Sam was busy. He wasn't just like heads down highway driving during that time, which might explain why his whereabouts are largely unaccounted for at least publicly between 3:30 and 6:30 which is when he spoke to a friend and reported being in
Colorado Springs
at that exit with a flat tire.Share
Brit Prawat
45:38
So, did the police know where he was planning on going?
Share
Ashley Flowers
45:41
They say they don't. But Audra says that she had heard he was headed to Texas to dispose of Mya's body. Of course he didn't make it there. If in fact, that's where he was going.
Share
45:51
He only made it as far as the highway exit near the power plant, which is where police spotted his car at 7:39 just three minutes later at 7:42. Sam died by suicide as officers approached his vehicle and that's where the timeline ends.
Share
Brit Prawat
46:04
That is a lot.
Share
Ashley Flowers
46:06
It is a lot. It's a lot for everyone for Audra and her sister of course for my as many friends and classmates and other students at her high school and it's a lot for Sam's family and friends too, who are just as rocked by this tragedy.
Share
46:20
According to ko double A News Five's coverage, the number of teen deaths by suicide in
Colorado
had risen nearly sixty percent in the three years leading up to this incident. That's the fastest rate in the country at the time.Share
46:33
And Sam's issues with
Mental Health
, which are not really reported in detail, but which Elizabeth Hernandez identified as depression in her piece for the Denver Post
were no secret. His friends knew Audra, New police knew to remember they had placed Sam under an emergency Mental Health
hold at least once before.Share
46:50
But even police who again had prior contact with Sam for
Domestic Violence
, didn't know what was actually happening inside Sam and Mya's relationship. Sam and Mya hadn't been dating that long actually, a few months.Share
47:03
But according to comments, the
Douglas County Sheriff
made, they'd known one another for years before that, Audra had met Sam for the first time in August so, like, five months before all of this and he and Mya had gone out once for ice cream.Share
47:17
And after that he didn't come around again and Mya didn't mention him. So, Audra figured it hadn't worked out and to be honest, she wasn't all that sad about it. But then in September after school started, Mya started hanging out with Sam again.
Share
47:29
But one of Audra's rules was that if Sam wanted to take her out, he had to come to the house and pick her up and like come inside for a chat first.
Share
Brit Prawat
47:36
Right? Not like a pull in the driveway and honk the horn situation.
Share
Ashley Flowers
47:40
Right. And it was during one of those discussions that Audra learned how difficult Sam's childhood had been, how much unresolved trauma that he was carrying around.
Share
47:49
And she also knew that that is what had drawn Mya to him in the first place. She had seen his broken heart and thought I got this in Mya's mind, Sam just needed some stability and understanding and unconditional love and he would thrive. On the
Facebook
page Audra writes quote, "As time went on, there were occurrences that I totally didn't approve of.Share
48:10
And so I started to be more concerned, concerned about many things, Mya being my ultimate concern. I remember my younger self and my stubbornness and headstrong mentality which Mya inherited. So, I treaded lightly with the situation as not to push her further into a bad situation. "End quote.
Share
48:27
And of all people, Audra knows how bad of a situation this could be. She'd seen it before. She had lived it before as a victim of
Domestic Violence
herself.Share
Brit Prawat
48:36
And I feel like that's such a blessing and a curse. Not that
Domestic Violence
is ever, ever a blessing, but experiencing that living through that getting through that would definitely help Audra recognize the signs probably quicker than the average parent, but at the same time, I know for me, it would feel that like overwhelming urge. I have to just cover my kids in bubble wrap and never let them out of my sight.Share
Ashley Flowers
48:59
I mean like you want them to learn from your mistakes so they don't make the same ones.
Share
Brit Prawat
49:03
But evolution does not work that way unfortunately.
Share
Ashley Flowers
49:06
No, but Audra was concerned enough about what she saw between Sam and Mya to start pulling together family members and friends to try and talk to Mya about breaking things off with him. And in early November, that's exactly what Mya had done.
Share
49:18
But not long after Audra got a frantic call from her daughter saying that Sam was in the hospital, he attempted suicide and because he'd done this right after the break up right after telling her that he couldn't live without her, Mya felt responsible.
Share
49:33
And in Mya's mind, Sam had no one, no one but her. So they got back together and Audra watched for weeks as Sam got more jealous and more possessive, more obsessive.
Share
49:44
Finally, in early January, Audra put her foot down and told Mya there would be absolutely no more seeing this boy, he's not good for you. He's hurting you and something bad is going to happen. I can feel it, but nothing, no lived experience, no mother's intuition, nothing could have prepared her to be right about that.
Share
Brit Prawat
50:03
I mean this really isn't a story about loved ones not seeing the signs of a violent relationship, Audra knew exactly what to look for. It sounds like Mya knew what to look for too. And I think that's actually the part of what makes the issue of
Teen Dating Violence
in particular so f--- scary to me because even in a situation like this where people saw what was happening and did everything they could or at least everything they felt they could to prevent it, Mya still ended up a victim.Share
Ashley Flowers
50:30
Right. Honestly, it's the same in Emma's story too. Like her parents taught her friends thought even she saw it and that's why it's so important. Again, like I I could remember being this age and thinking that, you know, oh, I know better than everyone else or ignoring things that you shouldn't ignore.
Share
50:46
And I think that's why it's so important that again that these messages not only passed down through parents but teenagers themselves hear these stories and know that it can happen because I promised you both of these girls, never thought in a million years, this is how it would end.
Share
50:59
And I get that it is so hard to see when you're in it. But intimate partner violence is nothing like random stranger violence.
Share
51:05
You guys know that the person hurting you physically mentally, sexually is also the person that you love or loved so much and it is really, really hard to untangle that and here's the thing you guys, if you're listening to this and you're in high school right now, I want you to stop what you're doing and listen to my words because according to dosomething. org, one in three, young people will be in an abusive or unhealthy relationship, which means that if it's not happening to you, it is probably happening to someone, you know.
Share
Brit Prawat
51:36
That is an outstanding statistic.
Share
Ashley Flowers
51:39
One in three. So, it is happening everywhere, even if you're not seeing it yourself or hearing about it from your friends, I promise you it is happening. They just aren't talking about it.
Share
51:49
And in fact of that third that are in this unhealthy relationship, only a third of them will actually tell someone about it. And there's a lot of reasons for that, maybe it's that they can't see it. You've got hormones and self doubt and uncertainty for all those teen years and your brain is still very much under construction.
Share
52:06
You could be confused about how you feel about how you can love someone and feel hurt by them at the same time. Again, especially for people who have never experienced like a healthy relationship, you know what I mean? Or true love.
Share
52:16
That's the first thing you experience, you might think that's what's normal and maybe they're not telling people because they're scared of what might happen to them if they say something maybe, and we just saw this play out in both of these stories today, they're worried about what their partner might do to themselves if they leave.
Share
52:30
But I want you all to know what
Teen Dating Violence
looks like in the early days especially. So, you can see the red flags in your own relationships and in those of the people around you. So I'm actually going to get you to read this part. This is from teendevimonth. org.Share
Brit Prawat
52:46
Okay, so this is an article from January 2021, that lists some warning signs and it's written for parents, but it's I think completely applicable for everybody. It says quote, "Warning signs that could mean your team is in a toxic relationship include your teens partner is overly jealous or possessive. You may see that your teen spends less time with friends and family or stops participating in activities. They enjoyed jealousy and control can be exerted in a subtle way.
Share
53:13
That may be hard for a parent to see if your teens partner attempts to control how your child dresses influenced their social media use or tells them that certain friends are a bad influence. It should serve as a red flag. If your team's partner shows a lack of respect for your child's goals and ambitions, you should pay close attention to the dynamics in the relationship. If your team has worked to make the varsity team or wanted to work to save it for a car and their partner belittles their goals.
Share
53:38
Beware your team feels the need to continually check in with their partner one or both parties may be dealing with insecurity and jealousy. If your team doesn't respond to a text immediately, does their significant other begin to call incessantly unexplained injuries are one of the scariest signs for a parent?
Share
53:54
Never hesitate to ask questions. If you notice bruising scratches or other physical indicators that could mean abuse teens who are victims of physical or sexual abuse often feel embarrassed, afraid or protective of their partner so they may not tell the truth about what happened. "End quote.
Share
Ashley Flowers
54:09
If there's anything about Mya's story or Emma's story that sounds familiar because you're experiencing it in your own relationship. You need to tell someone, even if you're not sure honestly, especially if you're not sure. Tell your parents your best friend, a teacher, a grandparent and neighbor, even the police, but tell someone if things don't feel right, it's because they probably aren't right.
Share
54:32
You guys, I can't stress this enough. Trust. Your. Gut. Abusers are very, very good at making you feel like it's your fault or worse. Like it's all in your head, at least by telling someone you can get a second opinion, healthy relationship should lift you up, not tear you down.
Share
54:49
They should make you feel better and not worse and they should never ever leave marks on your body or your mind. For more information on
Teen Dating Violence
including where to go for help, visit, loveisrespect. org. If you think that your browser history may be monitored, you can also call them at 18663319474 or you can text. Loveis all one word to 22522.Share
55:17
We're actually gonna be making a donation to this organization and we're going to include all of that information and more in the show notes and on our website.
Share
Break
Brit Prawat
56:40
So, today's profit was submitted by our listener, Joe about his best friend Gary. He adopted Gary, the most gorgeous white dog from a shelter in
Montana
. And Gary had actually come from the meat trade in south Korea
and had been rescued, moved to Montana
to find a forever home And found Joe.Share
57:01
Now Joe is a big fan of motorcycles and in late 2018, shortly after he got Gary, he had bought a new motorcycle. Now actually I haven't been to
Montana
, have you? But that late in the year, I assume it's pretty cold and probably not the best like motorcycling weather.Share
57:18
So Joe put his new bike in a trailer and went down to
Las Vegas
for a few days to try out his new bike. And Gary went to a sleepover at grandma and grandpa's house. Joe's parents. Every morning, Gary would go out with Joe's parents dog written for a little morning stroll around the neighborhood.Share
57:35
They went together every morning for about an hour, just the two of them walking around the neighborhood. I think it's the cutest thing ever. And every morning they came back until one day Gary didn't and Joe's parents start freaking out. They didn't tell him right away. They went out looking for Gary all day, but they finally broke the news to Joe who was on the last night of his trip in
Las Vegas
, Joe said he barely slept that night and the twelve hour drive from Vegas
home the next day flew by.Share
58:05
All he wanted to do was get home and find Gary. Now this was now New Year's Day, 2019 and
Facebook
friends, family, Everyone in their little town was out and about looking for Gary with absolutely no luck. now a week goes by and one morning one of his mom's coworkers calls and she's like Gary is on my porch, come now and so Gerry's mom hops in, her car runs to a coworker's house and as soon as she hops out of the car.Share
58:36
Gary takes off. So she calls her husband. He comes out, he tries to chase Gary down nothing. Now. They got so excited about the idea of finding Gary and bringing him home to Joe. They forgot to tell Joe.
Share
Ashley Flowers
58:48
Oh no.
Share
Brit Prawat
58:49
So, they finally called Joe, wake him up and they're like, oh, we need your help because I think we have Gary. So, Joe heads out to his mom's coworkers place. He sees Gary off in the distance, kind of walking away, Joe calls him.
Share
59:04
Gary immediately stops, turns tail and runs straight into Joe's arms and they still have no idea where Gary was for that entire week. He had been missing. But it looked like he'd been well taken care of, I mean this is a white dog. He would kind of know if he was living on the streets, right?
Share
Speaker 1
59:23
So, they assume someone found him, took him in for a few days and saw the ad about a missing dog that Joe's mom had put in their local paper, which I think is the sweetest. And they're like, oh, shoot! And they kicked Gary out to head home.
Share
Brit Prawat
59:38
And it's been three years since Gary is still besties with Joe. They are now living with Joe's girlfriend and her three sons who all adore Gerry there, there, the four sons really and he can still be a little bit skittish around new people. But Joe said it hasn't stopped them from living their best lives together.
Share
Ashley Flowers
59:57
Did he ever get him a side car for his motorcycle? Because like that's what I need to know that the goals.
Share
Brit Prawat
01:00:03
So Joe, if you haven't done that yet, I think Gary would really appreciate going on some of those chips with you. And as always, I want to highlight a rescue local to our profit. So be sure to check out the
Humane Society Of Northwest Montana
, which we will be linking to on our website along with pictures of Gary at crimejunkiepodcast. com.Share
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